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  • John 1:10 pm on September 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: police informants, wonderland   

    The Use Of Police Informants During The 60s & 70s 

    A reader recently posted a comment concerning police tactics with the use of informants, or snitches. By no coincidence, I am writing a chapter for the book about the use of informants. In the Wonderland story we have two!  David Lind and John Holmes. Now, vice cops have no way into the drug dealing world, unless they bust some low-level user or dealer, maybe a delivery guy. We’ve all seen the TV shows. But in my research, I have found several cases from the 60s and 70s from the Northern California area that show airman from nearby Air Force bases dealing in, or being suspected of dealing in drugs. In 1968, this was right in Ron’s stomping ground. Drugs were everywhere.

    An informant is usually corralled by first getting caught with drugs. Rather than face some jail-time, and if approached, they will often agree to cooperate with authorities. The info they give cops may or may not be good intel. The War on Drugs is a real bitch and just because some informant tells a vice cop that there is weed at someone’s house – well that does not mean it is true.

    This quote is from a drug case in 1968, where an informant – who may have needed to score some brownie points with his detective – is caught in the middle. I wonder who these four airman were?

    The challenged affidavit was prepared by Detective Roy D. Whiteaker of the Yuba City Police Department, largely on information furnished by a police informant, James Ronald Brooks. Brooks contacted Detective Whiteaker on March 16, 1968, and told him that certain parties residing in an apartment house at 357 Ainsley Avenue were planning to transport two kilograms of marijuana from San Francisco to their apartment, at about 3 o’clock that afternoon. The informer, at Whiteaker’s direction, then went to the Ainsley Avenue apartment house to obtain more information if possible. Later, Brooks told the detective that upon his arrival at the apartment house he was invited into an apartment belonging to four airmen from Beale Air Force Base. One of the airmen was under the influence of narcotics; his eyes were glazed and dilated. After a few minutes, two airmen went to appellant’s apartment next door and returned with appellant. Appellant asked what Brooks wanted, and Brooks answered “grass.” Appellant looked at an airman named Vern and said, “I don’t want to,” and returned to his apartment alone. Brooks stated that appellant was also under the influence of narcotics, and that Vern had referred to him as an “acid freak.”

    The affidavit alleged that the Office of Special Investigation at Beale Air Force Base informed Detective Sergeant Smith that one of the suspect airmen had told a fellow serviceman that he had taken $100 from his bank account to buy part of two kilograms of marijuana. The affidavit also alleged that appellant had been convicted of a narcotics offense and that the Sutter County sheriff’s office had received confidential information that he was again using narcotics.

    The End.

    • Anon4Now 8:53 pm on May 31, 2020 Permalink | Reply

      Old thread, doesn’t look like anyone’s posted on this for a while.

      Cassie, if I’m remembering right, was supposed to have been related to David Lind. If Cassie was willing to take a DNA test from Ancestry, YSEQ, or Family Tree or the like, I’m buying. There’s ways to get a kit to that person without jeopardizing anyone’s privacy or safety.

      Any results are private, no need to share with anyone that person doesn’t wish to. But it’s an interesting concept, John.

      That old Lions Gate board was something. I called Lions Gate one day asking about it, I was told there was never any such thing from that movie studio. I was at work, I was in an auto accident later that day in the work vehicle.

      All a long time ago now. Both Governor Browns are gone now but Sacramento doesn’t seem to change too fast. Between the two they had state politics pretty well wrapped up for near 3/4 of a century.

      Anyhow, you have my email, John. If genetic testing is interesting to any of your people that were related to David (or even Barbara, now that I think about it), please write.


    • Patrick 8:20 pm on February 5, 2015 Permalink | Reply

      John has anyone seen the transcripts or rough copy of the book 4 on the floor by Tom Lang and Nills G ? In your interview w Kevin Deverral he mention Nills gave him a copy, can we get a copy as well? I did some searching on Bill Vlick and found his phone number and address in Vegas, tried calling to do a phone interview but his phone was not operable. Will keep you posted. Still want to get w Eddie before he dies and unsure how to reach him other than going to his cond and knocking on door? I have called several companies registered under his name in Cali all to no avail? Any suggestions? I would like to do my book or transcript for a show on Eddie.


    • Jayson 10:21 am on October 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Hey John…I think you do an awesome Job of this blog…And I realize that there is only so much information that you can provide being that its so limited…but i am fascinated by the entire “wonderland” saga and I check your site daily hoping for a new read…Maybe you could post things or maybe things from your book more then once every couple months…thanks


    • localarts 6:26 pm on September 25, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      You know, if that were true I think Ronnie would have been proud him. Probably would not have forgiven the debts he owned them & the antique gun thing but Launius would have shown Holmes a little more respect.


    • localarts 10:24 am on September 25, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      “Bludgeonings tend to be a crime of passion and anger. So that explains why the pipes instead of guns. They wanted the victims to experience pain over a longer period of time than a gunshot would afford. That said I would imagine the attackers were packing too, just in case”

      That’s true to a lesser degree. I believe everyone was “packing” with the exception of Holmes. You have to remember how close these houses were to one another. Multiple gun shots would have brought way too much attention. We’re talking a minimum five rounds of gun fire at 4 am.

      Everybody has their own theory but nobody knows what the real truth is and never will.


      • criticextraordinaire 6:05 pm on September 25, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Well I would not expect John to have been packing. If he had, he likely would have gotten the drop on the other guys and saved the day.


      • Anon4Now 11:05 pm on September 25, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Browsing through some old emails, it was Lori Sheirer: “…in October ’05 in the ‘Letter to Lori Scheirer’s Probation Officer’ thread…” and the fake obituary she was said to have posted to an online website. That was before she tried to drum up some kind of donations from NAMI. That’s what was found on the Web back then, anyway, and I still think that’s a terrible thing to do to an organization like NAMI. Those people are really crazy, and I’d hate to get that pack on my tail.

        Excerpt from an old email: ” Also, on Wonderland II, I seriously doubt that any such movie will ever be made due to the fact that the original Wonderland did not have a very wide release and didn’t make any money in the end. It will remain nothing more than a film with a cult like following.” I guess that’s where that ends.

        OK, a theory. What if some persons from Sacramento (probably easy to figure out who these were in the movie) were actually active police informants due to their wish to escape a pretty bad dope bust when they reached Southern California. This bust would have been in the Sacramento area. Either by manipulation from detectives, personal acquaintances, or unknown outside sources, they were guided to Southern California in their capacities as snitches. Then, either deliberately or by chance, they became involved in the Nash robbery. Now, the way this paid informant deal works, the snitch is the driving force behind the “crime.” He or she is the one who goads the unwitting “crew” into performing whatever act it is the detectives wish to happen, the “crime” itself. Here, for conversation’s sake, let it be the Nash residence be the robbery and Lind and Barbara be the instigators/informants. If Launius and Holmes were their initial targets, who knows, but according to the media of the ’80s and Wonderland, that’s how it ended. So Holmes, shown in the movie as the one wanting Nash hit for whatever reason, might have only been a dupe for the informants, who have to move fast to get the situation over with before they get caught either by the victims or by the cops should they wish to play even another angle to the whole mess, or wish to escape everyone by taking off their wires and riding into the sunset with all the cash they got from the robbery topped off with all the money they got from the detectives to work as snitches. Not so far fetched, you read things like this all the time with feds and snitches infiltrating motorcycle gangs.

        So there’s the robbery being all planned out with Lind maybe having a wire on him the whole time. Did you ever see anyone patting anyone else down in the movie? No? Perhaps there was law enforcement following the whole thing. Then the robbery happens, all the robbers are happy except Holmes, the robbed ones are quite angry, and, if there was law enforcement involved, they might be both happy and worried.

        Then (I think this was according to you, Critic), Lind goes to a motel with a prostitute and whoever it really was retaliated on the robbers, a retaliation done not with firearms, but with clubs of some kind (striated bars are the little dumbbell bars with the threaded ends). If Lind was an informant, then he would have been taken out of harm’s way after the robbery, and many prostitutes double their income by being informants, also (a quite untrustworthy group, though I’ve never known any); so that might really be true. If the involved law enforcement agency knew of (if not condoned) the retaliatory hit, they would have wished it to be sans guns not only to give the victims some kind of chance to escape or phone for help, but also to keep the NRA off their backs as we all know by the media that whenever a violent crime happens that includes gun play, all the nation gets in an uproar. Keeping the hit free of firearms (and knives, thinking about it) also keeps it “clean,” an important point should anyone successfully snitch on the detectives themselves after all the dust settled. And that’s truly the most dangerous part: those kind of cops really don’t want to get caught.

        Shouldn’t be too hard to work that into your chapter, John, as that’s how it was back then. Nancy Reagan and “Just Say No!”

        So, isn’t that a terrible thought? Something like this, an horrendous crime that still resonates over 30 years later, possibly being the result of a police sting. And remember Holmes supposed to be a terrible snitch who told on everyone including his porn friends, too, so that whole “crime” involved an entire grouping of honestly terrible police informants. Incredibly, I’d read on the old boards comments like “Wow! I wonder what it was like to party with those guys back in the day!” It was a real bummer. “Summer, baby, bummer!”

        Plausible idea, isn’t it? And remember also the comments about Lind having to “return to Sacramento” shortly after the robbery. Probably to check in with whatever detective he was working with. Anyway, just tossing this whole post out for a critique.

        Critic, you and Boogie are the aficionados here. Is all this Wonderland III?

        And, anyway, my OPEC/Sammy Hagar story, who knows? I know I heard that song in ’73. The computer says ’84, but that may simply be more secret 37th Marines light shows. The Web’s infallible, isn’t it? Here today, gone the next. When was the first time you heard that song?


        • Mark C 8:00 am on November 1, 2014 Permalink

          All people on here far as I know you Anon4Now might known Lind the best.
          Not trying put you on spot or nothing like that, But I just wonder if you happen to heard this story before?

          Or anybody can tell me if they read this too.

          I was just checking few facts trying keep everything straight in my mind this morning & on Wiki & ran into this I never heard about before. Not sure post link or not but because rules, its under wonderland murders

          Lind nor McCourt were present for the wonderland attack, as Lind was consuming drugs with a male prostitute called Shilo Watts in a motel and McCourt was at home.

          That 1st time I heard that story. I thought Lind was with 2 female prostitutes ? Maybe was in Sac.?
          Who is Shilo Watts or should we even waste our time with this? Don’t know what to believe or not to believe.
          Not trying say nothing about Lind, him & Watts just might been drug users friends I have no clue if this even true.
          Where do these stories come from?
          No wonder I have trouble keeping this story straight. Its about as bad as Holmes different life stories he told.


    • Anon4Now 9:09 am on September 25, 2014 Permalink | Reply


      Thanks for your thorough response. You’re right on all points, and I don’t intentionally mean to put words in person’s mouths or posts. I must have disremembered the post on IMDb about “Israeli mafia,” it might have been from someone else. But I think that might have been the first time I saw that phrase in print.

      OK, remember whoever it was that went to Wonderland hoped they’d find Lind there. Lind and Launius did time together in Chino (though I figured Lind would have been in a Northern California prison). People doing state time have years to be on the weight pile, they get incredibly strong. They really rival professional football players in strength, if not in speed as prison guards don’t like prisoners who can run fast (except in “The Jericho Mile”). Additionally, they get adept in cell fighting, either by figuring out quick, lethal holds on their own against their unhappy cellies, or by tutoring by older, more experienced cons wanting a “crew” of their own. These people are really strong, and you’ll know when you’ve been hit.

      If a group of persons bent on retaliation were to enter a house where there was even one of this kind of ex-con, nothing short of a bazooka would be needed to make sure nothing was left afterwards and a safe escape by the attackers be made. I know payback’s sweet for the aggrieved, but here the success of the payback would need be assured. Really, it’d be safer to throw explosives through a house window from blocks away than to go after someone like Lind or Launius with pipes. Prisoners are schooled on how to hit an attacking lunatic on their upper arms to momentarily paralyze their hands so a home-made shank gets dropped instead of inserted, and that’s why old-time cons would tape shanks into their hands before running into the cell next door to quiet things down. And they can move fast for brief periods; these aren’t normal people anymore, and family members notice that when they come home.

      Except the attackers were no doubt certain that the Wonderland residents would be too loaded to use any of their incredibly lethal skills. That’s how those things end, I guess. All that time on the weight pile,stuffed into their arms and all useless now. Maybe that’s why they didn’t use guns, they knew everyone was too stoned to fight back. I have another theory.

      Remember Sousa and “Four on the Floor?”

      I remember talk of an adult museum in LA, I think you’re right there.

      And thanks for speaking with me.


    • Anon4Now 8:51 pm on September 23, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I’m going to try to respond to your post, Critic, except there’s no “reply” to click on, only “Permalink.” I hope it’s the same.

      I have no way to tell if the purple haze commie light was true or not. Odd things happen, and it could be that Launius had a built-in starlight scope which would be a handy natural tool to have. Sure to get him promotions if his squad leader knew about it. And, thinking about it from another angle, maybe he was Air Force but still wanted to go out with the grunts from time to time. If he had a friend that was a Marine, maybe he got to tag along a few times. Getting across the border from Thailand to a northern Vietnam-stationed Marine unit might have been a chore, but not impossible for someone serious about it. You read about Vietnamese successfully going the opposite way all the time.

      I remember the “girl in the closet” story appearing on the Lions Gate board at a later time than many of the other posts. That was supposed to be that Laurie girl that everyone used to get mad at, wasn’t it? Not Laurie Holmes, but the Laurie that used to try to hustle donations from NAMI or something. I remember Laurie Holmes was supposed to be upset about purported copyright infringements on the use of Holmes’ name and personal history (which I know nothing of as I never knew him or any of his friends). I remember a poster named Cap that did a lot of sp@m or something; it took me a while to notice Cap Mauzner’s name. There was also a Boogie Night, easy to remember due to the other Wonderland-type movie.

      Some of the posts I remember was about how surprised people were about Wonderland getting jerked from the theaters so fast, and when they did its remake or sequel they were going to “do it right this time.” Thinking about it, it was almost as if they were in shock or something. They shouldn’t have been, they should have realized they’d catch some strong feelings just from Holmes’ profession alone. Then, there’s all the Sacramento politics that came with it, maybe that’s what caught them unawares.

      I remember when x-rated movies started getting space on the Sacramento newspaper’s family movie pages. A little section at the bottom of the page under Disney and blaxploitation ads, Holmes, Seka, all the other names you remember from those days. The only way porn got away with that was all the press they were getting at the time about being anti-war, pro-peace, non-violence, and anti-drug; they were the squeakiest, cleanest, most wholesome people you could imagine, they just liked to hop on each other naked and in front of the camera.

      Then Lind met Holmes and all that crashed down. It seems that the porn folks got really angry about that as they lost untold billions from Holmes himself, and lost much of their credibility as being anti-violence and anti-drug. Lost much of their political platform and financial support, one fell swoop.

      As I remember your posts, Critic, you and Boogie were pro-Nash and porn. Judging Nash’s roots, you should find my OPEC story interesting. Sammy Hagar’s “I Can’t Drive 55” got a real “Ride of the Valkyries” spin from AFN. I can’t knock the story about Launius’ black light turning VCs into glowing Jimmy Hendrix posters, as I really know what I heard. So, what we’ve just done here, John, is not only bump Cap Mauzner, but Oliver Stone, too. That was easy.



      • criticextraordinaire 6:55 pm on September 24, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Well I always assumed that the “violet light from the forehead” was really rhetorical and not literal. Like Ronnie was saying (if he said anything at all) that he could really zone in on Charlie. Whatever his story in ‘Nam, the various constabularies in California certainly appear to have had a modicum of respect for his capabilities. I always kinda wondered how you go from being a kick-ass member of a SOG team to being a supply clerk in Bangkok though.

        Can’t exactly say I am pro-Eddie, but with regard to the whole Wonderland hit, I’ve gone on record that basically Ronnie and Billy (as well as David and I suppose Tracy) were basically asking for it. I mean shucks… you do what they did to Eddie and his foot dogs are not supposed to get rough? While I respect Ronnie for his chutzpah, he pretty much got what he had coming after that. And nobody pulled that kind of stunt on Eddie ever again.

        I remember Boogie Knight, he was definitely a Holmes connoisseur; I think he knew all of Johnny’s flicks. Encyclopaedic knowledge of all things Holmesian. To me John is a nostalgic figure; I remember as a kid the local newspapers running full-page ads for the latest Johnny Wadd films starring “Big John” Holmes, or lesser flicks starring the likes of Tony “The Hook” Perez or the Ivory Snow girl. Back then everybody knew of Johnny Holmes, he was a folk hero, sort of counterculture-gone-mainstream. So any story involving John takes me back to the old days when things were simpler.

        I also remember one dude who allegedly got fired from his job at a paper manufacturing company, for using his company email account to send unpleasant emails to some gal on the LionsGate board who was a regular. That LionsGate board was wild for sure. No wonder they shut it down.

        Oh and also there was a postress named WILDHEART (always in all caps) who got herself a set of custom license plates for her automobile… “WADD”. Awesome.


        • Anon4Now 10:36 pm on September 24, 2014 Permalink

          “Can’t exactly say I am pro-Eddie…” I remember one post that was made under your name (not saying it was you) I think on the IMDb board where you said Nash was “Israeli mafia.” Some of that IMDb talk was mirrored on the Lions Gate board. I don’t know what a “mafia” is, but I’ve watched all the Puzo movies like everyone else. When someone mentions “mafia” I think of ethnic or multi-racial Hollywood-type criminal groups, or “crews” as they’re called on the Net. But I thought Nash was Palestinian?

          There was one girl from the Oak Park area of Sacramento, that might have been the Wildheart you were talking about. She was also making some kind of arty-type creations with a Wadd theme.

          I don’t know what “screen caps” are, but one female poster (as I remember it) was making “screen caps” for some kind of Wonderland-Wadd type production. If any’s been made I’ve never seen it.

          I think there was another female poster whose father had once been employed at a Great Lakes-area brewery like Budweiser or something.

          I remember the story of the paper-plant employee, but I thought it was Laurie working there scaring people. I think I read that she’d been in prison for killing someone for a bag of dope. Honestly, that’s a bit much. From what I’ve heard (no personal experience; I’ve never grown or manufactured drugs, so I don’t honestly know anything about drugs one way or the next) people can’t just go around getting even with everyone every time they buy a small quantity of bad dope. It might not be the dealer’s fault, it might be his supplier having to cut back for a moment. Or maybe not, maybe it is an intentional burn. But maybe the burner will make it up to the burnee at a later time after he gets his foodstamps or something; it’s not something to immediately go into a terminal spin over. That’s simply not good business.

          Since Wonderland came out there’s been a lot of drug legalization movements in many states, and press like what Laurie’s said to have is exactly what causes these changes. Do you remember the pound of baking soda story and the post by someone that they should name a “new drug” after Launius or whoever it was that did that? Now that’s a larger amount of burn, one that would probably warrant a payback. But small time thefts like Laurie’s, and the braggadocio that follows petty crime like that, becomes so repellent after decades go by people will try to change things just to shut them up.

          Which leads into Nash. Was that merely a drug theft? Now honestly, Critic, as many decades as you’ve been discussing this, why wouldn’t guns have been used by whoever it was that did the payback crime (some posters back then talked about a MacLeane family, I’m sure I’ve spelled that wrong)? They obviously weren’t worried about being overheard, there was always a lot of noise from that house anyway.

          I can’t find it right now, but there’s an article on the Web somewhere about a Sacramento Oak Park-area woman whose dog saved her from a home invader a few years ago. I noticed her name as being one that posted on a Wikipedia Wonderland-type related forum, and the home invasion happened a short time after her post (got to see if I can find that). No idea who that woman is, didn’t recognize her picture and Oak Park’s a real wild side of town my parents never told me about anyway, so no clue, just noticing the time coincidence. Me, when I first started following this subject around in 2004, I had a fun time around my house. I’ve moved since then.

          So, how have you been?


        • criticextraordinaire 5:50 am on September 25, 2014 Permalink


          I would never have referred to Eddie as “Israeli Mafia” for the reason you had stated, he is Palestinian as I understand. Besides, most of the Israeli Mafia of which I am aware came from Russia, Uzbekistan, or Georgia and did not emigrate to the USA. These days you hear them referred to euphemistically as “Israeli businessmen”. I probably would have referred to The Nash as a guy not to be messed with based on his reputation in the press and his various convictions.

          Why were guns not used in the hit at 8763? Because it was a revenge hit. For the attackers it was personal, they wanted to inflict pain, send a message to anybody else who might want to mess around. Any murder investigator will tell you that. Bludgeonings tend to be a crime of passion and anger. So that explains why the pipes instead of guns. They wanted the victims to experience pain over a longer period of time than a gunshot would afford. That said I would imagine the attackers were packing too, just in case.

          I do not buy the McLean theory because in that case, if this was a situation where a fellow drug dealer was simply exacting revenge for a baking soda scam, the Gang would indeed have been shot. Strictly business, get in and get out. Nope… the bludgeoning aspect of this crime tells me it was personal.

          WILDHEART… Yeah I remember now, I think she made an art creation for an exhibit in Hollywood for some sort of Museum of Adult Cinema event, something like that. Might have been a decoupage handbag or similar. WILDHEART was always a fun poster, kept things light on the boards. When I was in LA a few years later I kept an eye out for those WADD plates. 🙂

          The chick you mention re: the drug murder… she was acquitted by a jury and so did not do any time for that crime which I believe stands as being officially unsolved. As I recall I think there was a false confession due to some sort of multiple-personality situation but it’s been a long time. It is alleged that she died in 2005 but some of us are not so sure about that, despite the obituary that was printed in a Midwestern newspaper and her Find-A-Grave memorial. Of course if she really is dead then may she RIP.


    • anon4no2 9:27 pm on September 19, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I don’t know if urls copy to your blog, but apparently one of the airmen’s name was Vern: https://www.courtlistener.com/calctapp/c19E/people-v-hill/

      I suppose this website was where you got your post. Conversationally, I’ve found some old cases on the computer that are oddly gone now. Specific relevancy to the Wonderland case is questionable, but they do give some background to the Sacramento County crime scene that led to what really is the devastation caused to the entire state by Sacramento detective’s crime solving “expertise.” It doesn’t happen overnight: http://law.justia.com/cases/california/calapp2d/98/770.html and: http://law.justia.com/cases/california/cal2d/34/669.html

      OK, I get to do this, John. Please post this message, there is really nothing inflammatory in it. Gen. Pease was one of those real American heroes we watch Hollywood movies about, and I don’t include these old cases without reason. Beale AFB isn’t far from Sacramento, and Barbara’s people lived in Rancho Cordova, as I remember it. That’s where Mather AFB was when it had the B-52 squadron there. Everyone remembers the protest those got. Gen. Pease became a very influential Sacramento attorney (even though he apparently lost these two cases. Can’t win ’em all).

      A decade ago you’d read on the Web that Launius was a Marine stationed in Vietnam with the 37th Marines. Posters whom I do not know would place on chat boards that he was responsible for 37 homicides; it was easy to remember the coincidence of his crimes and military unit. There was even a 37th Marines veteran website, had Vietnam-era Marine photos on it and everything. Then, over the years his military service changed to Air Force and he was transferred, if you will, from Vietnam to Thailand. The number of homicides he was credited with changed, also, no idea if they now matched the squadron number of whatever he was stationed with in Thailand. All mention of any US 37th Marines (even the unit reunion website) disappeared from the Web.

      I never knew Launius, but I do know that if he served honorably (or even nearly honorably as those were really difficult years to be in the nation’s military) his memory shouldn’t be slandered. Or, with the way Hollywood has of artfully altering history to make everything more screen-sparkly, not slandered too awful badly.

      Whatever the argument was in Sacramento with the California veterans who were drafted and sent to the Pacific both during WW II and Vietnam, and those who were in the WW II ETO and stateside, you can actually follow the timeline of the state’s legislator’s (the state capitol’s) demise. These were veterans that were worthy of their own movies, ones that’ll never be seen. The Cold War cast many of these veterans into obscurity and slow dissolution, and we read about it today in movies like Wonderland after their families were forced off their property after the war.

      Lind and Barbara were also persons who had backgrounds not entirely as depicted in Wonderland. But, so what? Hollywood needs villains just like Big Time Wrestling.


      • criticextraordinaire 6:45 pm on September 22, 2014 Permalink | Reply


        I read on the old Lionsgate board a post from an old ‘Nam buddy of Ronnie’s. His buddy said that Ronnie wanted to go out on a mission with a SOG team and was allowed to do so. He claimed that Ronnie could see Charlie in pitch black conditions because a purple light shone from his head into the darkness and he could see the VC like it was daylight. Assuming this is true, the characterization of Ronnie as ‘fearless’ would seem to be spot on.

        I think he also mentioned that they got ambushed by some VC and that Ronnie dispatched quite a few either with a bayonet or simply a combat knife. It was a few years ago so I forget some of the details.


        • Anon4Now 8:37 pm on September 22, 2014 Permalink

          Hi, thanks for your reply. I’ve read nearly all your posts for the past decade, and I understand you to be an intelligent and mature person, and I really enjoy your concern for this whole predicament. That’s what it truly is.

          I also know that there’s a lot of showbiz in this old story. I am not a showbiz person, and I become confused at times by some person’s efforts at embellishing or distorting what happened back then. The statute of limitations has expired long ago for anything involved in this Wonderland thing excepting capital crimes. Due to the deaths of many of the involved parties, even that is not a bothersome point.

          You were probably talking about that Grunt person who posted on Lions Gate. He had some conversation with Russ, another poster. I personally don’t remember much about that other than Grunt talking about some patrol he was involved in where he had contact with NVA or VC. I do remember a few posters there really hyping up Launius’ lethalness bost during the war and after. I imagine that’s true, but what you reference was when Launius was said to be a Marine in Vietnam rather than in the Air Force in Thailand stuffing body bags full of dope.

          I do remember the story of violet beams that would project from Launius’ forehead to pinpoint VC. This next is a story I’ve never told to anyone other than an Army veteran of Granada at the VA. No real idea of how we came to talk, but anyway I was stationed with an airborne unit in Germany when the first OPEC took off at the end of ’73. The airborne unit got transferred to Italy so they’d have a short hop across the Med should the OPEC nations continue to withhold oil. I didn’t go to Italy with them, I was transferred to another station in Germany, but as the barracks was clearing out I heard a song on the radio (tuned to AFN) that I always remember as the singer’s last name was the same as my parent’s neighbors, Hagar. It was Sammy Hagar singing “I Can’t Drive 55.” Nice song, and it was when the nation was reducing all the speed limits to 55 and under to conserve gas.

          Of course, you’ll find on the computer that Hagar came out with this song in 1984, over 10 years later. Yet, I know I heard this on USAREUR’s AFN station as the airborne was leaving, it happened and it’s too bad that Launius is said to have commie finding beams of light darting from his forehead. Is that a real story, or was he in Thailand? Mine’s real.

          The Hagar family I knew is the one that introduced me to Lind and Barbara. Hollywood people can have all the fun with this they want to, and they can slander the veterans who had to serve this miserable nation in a time that they will always be despised and reviled for, but what happened was real back then.

          Grunt’s a generic name for infantry. I used to get speeding tickets.


        • criticextraordinaire 5:46 pm on September 23, 2014 Permalink


          Are you saying that the purple light story that was at Lionsgate was BS? Possibly could be, just like the “girl in the closet” story that has pretty much been discredited. People can post pretty much anything they want in the interweb.


      • Mark C 8:31 am on September 26, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I don’t know much about the purple light story, I read the above story and not sure but this might or maybe not explain what they talking about.

        After like 35 years of my life without knowing & 1 real good pre-job physical, I found out I was very minor Color Blind just some different shades of color, Not the traffic stop light type, I can’t see the color of the light’s type, I can see that good.

        All my life people hunting with myself never could figure out how I saw wild game so fast and good. I throw gun up and go Boom and scare them to 1/2 to death all the time, Because they never saw what I be shooting at until I go & get the Grouse Or Wild Turkey or what ever wild game we would happen to be hunting for at that given time.

        Within last few years, I saw my older cousin after way over 30 + some years ago without us seeing each other, He lived many states away. He was in Nam and we found out we both was same type of way Color Blind, He told me it was different shades of colors he saw help him pick out stuff that most others could not spot quickly.

        He told me within his 1st few days in Nam he was told to take “The Point” & told Sgt. I don’t know if you really want me up there, I am a little bit Color Blind, But Sgt. told him that great luck has hit our Platoon because that is the very person they wanted on point. After that my cousin spent his tour mainly on point & everybody trusted him, Most all the time’s his Platoon got hit. My cousin would be in rear area over small injury or some other minor mishap. But thank god he did make it back home physically in pretty good shape,

        Little research very lot of my family that was in military before from Rev. War onward has been snipers & before K-Ratios I guess in-between sniper trips they would hunt for wild game to feed the troop’s mainly before WW1 when troops really didn’t have all that easy food & ready to eat meals handy.

        One pretty famous Rev. War battle my couple great grandfather & his son’s name is on the list of being there in the battle, But in truth he a was few miles away hunting for fresh meat to feed the troops & heard the battle start but it was over by the time he & his son made it back to the battle area. That true story been told through many generations of family folk-lore.

        This just a idea what these soldiers could be talking about. Could not be.. I really don’t know. Just a idea maybe could explain what they are talking about on the Purple Light Story.


        • Anon4Now 8:47 pm on September 26, 2014 Permalink

          Just noticed your post, Mark. Those are great stories.

          I’ve read articles about people have extra cones or whatever they are in their eyes. That enhances their perceptions of color and shade. Just found the article: http://discovermagazine.com/2012/jul-aug/06-humans-with-super-human-vision

          This might only pertain to women, but who knows?

          The story of your Revolutionary ancestor was nice, too. If your unit is involved in a battle or skirmish, you’re said to be included in it as long as you weren’t AWOL or something. Reality is different, someone might have been on guard duty the night before and if it’s a short battle, it might be over before he even wakes up. My father always denied being in the Battle of the Bulge, and it wasn’t until I got a computer that I found out parts of his division was in the Bulge and Hurtgen Forest (the last one I never even heard of before). His specific unit was elsewhere, probably a few miles away.

          The Revolutionary ancestor my mom’s family used to get into DAR wasn’t even a uniformed soldier, from what I can tell. He participated in the “Braintree Riot” when some British troops rode into town. No idea what he did, but he might have just thrown rocks or something.

          That was nice, Mark.


        • Mark C 7:18 pm on September 30, 2014 Permalink

          Thanks a lot for your reply.

          That was the 1st, I guess Professor type grade report I ever read about Color Blindness, Dr. found it in me told me it was a lot of times inherited through your family gene lines.
          But this my eye site is and just a every day normal thing for myself.

          I never would known about my cousin color blindness who was right there and fought in Nam unless we wasn’t setting back one night drinking a few cold ones & I told him I didn’t think Military would put me in combat over my eye site & he told me it sure didn’t help him if anything it hurt him having to be out on point about his whole tour. Very nerve racking I would guess,
          Then he told me all about his story and about our uncle who told him after his tour in Nam was over about his own experiences in Pacific in WW2 who was a underwater demo expert that had and was same color blindness type as us.

          I guess only way we ever will know if Ronnie was maybe really Color Blind is if we ever find out if Color Blindness ran in his family kin-folk or gene line. My guess getting his Medical Records be more than a very long shot for us. Maybe John can wave his magic wand on that stunt needs to be pulled.

          To myself Color Blindness would make more common sense than a “Purple Beam” coming from Ronnie’s forehead. But who knows with Ronnie, But I just have a feeling Ronnie might been the type to play up any type in his own mind of any Superman type extra abilities he may had. Plus Ronnie I think wanted fame. Surely not how he got it, But I do think he wanted to be famous.

          Ronnie keep coked up head Holmes supplied in Coke and around for a while even though Billy did not like Holmes just so I think people would know Holmes worked for him..

          You don’t see that trait or I don’t in Billy. Billy interesting guy himself, but I feel he was little bit more on the quiet side but more reasonable level headed and not so quick for action. But if that story is true about Billy & McCourt was going pull the Nash hit themselves when everybody else was going pull out. Then I wonder?? But this case is as bad as Holmes own stories go on what really is the truth and what is a bunch of BS.


        • Anon4Now 12:04 am on October 7, 2014 Permalink

          And thanks again for your posts, Mark. You write well; it’s easy to follow your thought process. With extra cones you could have super vision of a sort. At least, that’s what it says in one of those articles.

          Like I told John, my interest in this story is Sacramento-based. After that, I don’t have much conversation. I don’t know anything about porn, never knew anyone in it, and don’t really think I’d get along well with them even if they didn’t know I used to know Lind. Sounds like some of them might be angry about things.

          But, I do have a couple memories I’d like to share if it’s OK with you, John. Like I said in my emails, this treatment that you’ve given the movie seems mature, unlike some of the old chat boards. My input isn’t inflammatory, rather it’s simply thought-provoking.

          Anyway, Barbara was near to true beauty. Under closer scrutiny, maybe she was one or two jots off, but she was very attractive and had personality. One mutual friend had a duplex, and, when Lind and Barbara were there and he had to take off for a while to do something, he’d leave Barbara there with whoever else was present at the time. Barbara, maybe when she was feeling rambunctious, would say something like “Good, David, maybe I’ll have _____ to [play with] while you’re gone.” She did that with me once, and Lind got this really weird look on his face and said “Good, maybe he can.” That was truly frightening: Barbara was someone I never actually got closer than friendship with, I always remember that look on Lind’s face, it was a real deterrent.

          I had an immediate family member die in ’80, and Barbara came over to my parent’s house with another male friend one day. They spent a night or two, and I noticed later that my mom’s tub of Albolene Cream had some massive finger scoops taken out of the middle of it. Usually my mom used it for chapped lips and a tub would last a decade or so, and I asked Barbara if she knew anything about it. She got excited and said it’s ‘way better than Vaseline cream as it warms up when friction’s applied. It seems she liked it a lot.

          This was after Lind had gotten busted, and he called collect from the Sacramento County Branch Jail in Elk Grove asking if I’d seen Barbara. That part of the jail is for misdeamenors, traffic tickets, DUIs, and light weight felonies. It’s far from prison, and it’s sort of proof that whatever it was he got busted for, he did county time rather than prison. Unless, of course, he was in the security side of it and still going to court. They do that there, too, to be fair to him, and I never asked him what side of the jail he was on. But obviously he was out in a very short time judging by Wonderland’s time frame. I lied to him, I didn’t tell him she’d been there with the other male as I figured he’d find out about it himself and I’d claim amnesia or something. I felt bad, but didn’t want to bum his time out. But he did that, he called and if they still have old phone records, it’d be there.

          Without rambling about too much, Barbara and I wandered around my parent’s back yard one day. It was a virtual park, my father grew up on a farm and had a very green thumb. No drama, just a really nice memory I have of her, kind of scenic.

          Those two people were human. Both had quirks, and, John, if and when you write your book, if you want to focus on the dehumanizing aspect of law enforcement turning out snitches, be the snitches willing or unwitting police accomplices, these are maybe two good examples. Barbara still had sweetness, and I’d say Lind was still a man at the time. Of course, his crowd’s definition of man-ness really differs from the common citizen’s and they’re far better judges of their own type than I am, but he still had his human part. You could tell by his demeanor and conversation, and Barbara could be truly sweet when she wanted to be.

          I never did anything so criminal that they’d make a profit off of snitching on me, but my family did later lose the property. But that happened to a lot of Sacramento families back then, and how that all came about really puts a different spin on the whole Wonderland story.

          Thanks very much for the responses I got here, and this is where my story ends. Nice place, John.


    • localarts 4:39 pm on September 18, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Not sure Barbara’s parents would have approved of that.


    • criticextraordinaire 5:46 am on September 9, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I always wondered how David Lind could get away with being an alleged snitch. I mean, the circles in which it is alleged he ran would never tolerate that sort of thing. Rat out those guys to the cops and next thing you know, you’re found in a ditch somewhere with a dollar bill stuffed in your mouth.

      But that then raises the question… did Lind really pass away in 1995, or was he spirited away to the Witness Protection Program as I have heard in some forums? ???


      • Anon4Now 8:10 pm on September 9, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        As I remember things I used to read, most followers of this tragedy knew Lind was let into witness protection after the first trial, when both he and Holmes tried to enter it. He was already in it when he died in ’95, if he really did die and if he wasn’t kicked out of the program for drug use or crime.

        The part of your post that does make sense is if he did get kicked out. If he got whisked away to another part of witness protection other than what he was already in, it’d probably be for misusing his good fortune. But it’s like you read, once in protection, no one will ever get a straight answer from law enforcement about your whereabouts or new name and SSN. Not even their wives or mothers; once they’re gone, they’re gone unless they blow it.

        And getting away with snitching of this magnitude in Sacramento may have happened, perhaps, due to these rampaging crankster-gangsters having mothers, brothers, or wives working in the state capitol or law enforcement. These crazed wild men usually had rich daddies up there, many of whom were cops or state workers. It’s easier to be a wild biker if your dad foots the bill.

        “Rat out those guys to the cops…” You mean their grandfathers? Or their father-in-laws?


        • localarts 3:38 pm on September 16, 2014 Permalink

          If Lind is alive, he would be in is 70’s. I think Lind is with butterfly, probably has been for some time.


        • criticextraordinaire 7:40 pm on September 17, 2014 Permalink

          If Lind is indeed dead, it is too bad that he did not get to be buried next to Butterfly.


        • Mark C 10:31 am on September 26, 2014 Permalink

          They said Henry Hill from Goodfellows movie fame got completely kicked out of The Witness Protection Program all together, So I guess this very well could of happen to David Lind too maybe???. It sure I guess would not been the very 1st time in history that did happened.

          What they deported Carlos Marcello one time out in middle of a Guatemala rain forest jungle miles from anybody in dress clothes & shoes one time back in 1961, He was wondering around for like 3 days out in middle of that rain forest before he could get to any other people. Govt. can be pretty mean if they want to be.

          Well I think in Henry Hill case, He was getting caught for DUI like about weekly, And going back and/or calling NYC all the time without Fed’s knowing. Dealing dope and number other crimes I think he got caught up in while he was still in the Witness Protection Program.

          What little I read I think Henry was the poster boy for the Witness Protection Program Bad Boy Program. Or what rules not to break in the program. I think he was moved at least 3 or more different times and he still kept getting into trouble all the time. He lived for a time in a little small Northern KY town not far from my own home I found out later on. Then I think he went somewhere out around the Seattle area.

          He loved his ponies and gambling.

          Year’s later I had the luck to not personally meet Henry, but I did say Hi and walked right by Henry Hill near a east coast resort town one pretty summer day, Yes he did have 2 Bodyguards with him that day. I asked 1 of the Bodyguards, He told me yes that was Henry from Goodfellows movie fame, But Henry looked pretty drunk to myself at only @ 1 pm right after lunch time and he just keep walking by like a jerk to myself. He must had a lot of lunch time drinks he looked to myself as he was down right staggering.

          But this was after his movie fame & books even a cook book and web site came out, I still can’t get over just how small and short Henry was in real life and here he was played up as this big tough mean mobster in the movie’s. Well it was only a few years before his death, But he looked only about 5-6 maybe 145 pds at that time to myself, but I was still kind of shocked at just how small & ill health looking he was, But too I am fairly big guy myself, I played WR in Football for many years.


  • John 10:01 am on August 12, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: anthony mudarris, , , wonderland   

    More From Jerry Vann’s Book… 

    Jerry is quite a character, obviously. You can read more by ordering his book here at Amazon.

    It was easy back then (late 70s/early 80s) to use stolen credit cards, because there was no swiper machine or computers. This was one of their biggest scams it appears. The clerk ran carbons of the card, the old fashioned way. On big ticket items like jewelry, they may call the credit company, but if the stolen card was fresh and not yet reported, it was all clear to buy stuff with.

    Again, Greg is Jerry’s friend (it’s not Greg Diles) and Tony is Nash underling, Anthony Mudarris. The Nash attorney, Mr. Blaish, is still around LA doing business… from a few Google searches.



    In the following scene, Jerry and Greg had been nailed at a mall using stolen credit cards to buy a watch. They tried to make a run for it but were caught, since they were both out of shape. Jerry was also in trouble at this time because he had been arrested for firing a gun in the air or towards D.A. investigators who had been watching him.

    Famous bail bondsman, Hal Glickman, also makes a cameo. Hal is deceased (about 10 years I believe). His wife, Dottie, who allegedly picked up Holmes that night, died of breast cancer on New Year’s Eve in 1997. Their son, who later took over the family bail biz, has not yet responded to my emails and FB messages requesting an interview.

    In the end, in my opinion, Nash had money and connections, he could even order a hit if he wanted. But he was really just a wealthy coke-head, pulling extracurricular scams, arsons and frauds for quick cash. He chased women day and night. To me, Nash was a slick wiseguy who used others to insulate himself from the crimes. Pure Nash.


    • localarts 12:13 pm on September 12, 2014 Permalink | Reply



    • localarts 8:27 pm on September 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Lee Meriwether was beyond hot!


      • criticextraordinaire 5:48 am on September 9, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Ms. Meriwether is still hot.


        • Bobby 8:19 am on September 12, 2014 Permalink

          I believe they call that ‘prunetang’.


        • criticextraordinaire 7:41 pm on September 17, 2014 Permalink

          I’d still hit it…


    • Stacey Jane Lind Ferraro 7:38 pm on August 27, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Only the picture on the far right is David Clay Lind I should know he is my dad.I was looking for pictures of him too and can not find any youg ones but I saw him from ’92 to 94 .


      • John 10:12 am on September 2, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Hi Stacey,

        Thanks for visiting the blog. I am John. I am writing a book about the Wonderland Murders.

        I would like to interview you sometime about your dad. Very little is known about him. I have only found what little I know about him thru background checks, and they can be erroneous sometimes.

        Please email me back! wonderland1981blog at gmail.com



        • Hymie 3:34 pm on September 6, 2014 Permalink

          What would you like to know?


      • Anon4Now 8:33 am on September 6, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        There was a Cassie Lind who used to post on another board. I found out later that board wasn’t a Lions Gate board though the posters there claimed it was. Who knows, but the Sacramento detectives that worked Lind and other of his contemporary paid informants caused much havoc with their type of police “tactics.”

        Problems with this type of police work is the perps are really the victims and it’s really impossible for them to ever escape the system. The snitches that they turn out eventually are disenchanted, too, but for them it’s all too late.

        If you’re really one of Lind’s daughters, you should remember a couple of his Sacramento friends. Brad, maybe?


        • John 12:48 pm on September 8, 2014 Permalink

          Thanks Anon. I am writing a chapter for the book about the use of police informants in the 1970s. It was a different era, and like vice cops today, informants and snitches were an important part of their investigation, however sketchy… legally… those tactics are….


      • Pepe 4:25 pm on September 6, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Were you visiting in Santa Rosa?


    • Miranda 3:45 pm on August 19, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      To those of you who think you are strange, I must also be! I find true crime interesting. I read up on different cases and this is one I have read into some about the dynamics of persons involved. Crazy how different they were yet drugs brought them all together. I have heard before that if you do drugs or get into the drug culture you will find others who are on the same track.


  • John 9:42 am on July 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , miami, motel row, wonderland   

    BeeGees Capture Street Imagery Of Fabulous Motel Row 

    We hit 500,000 page views this week 😉

    In July, 1981 – John Holmes and his girl, Dawn, had fled to Miami, ending up at the Fountainhead Inn. During this time it was considered not-so Fabulous Motel Row. It’s heyday was over…. well today, I found this video for the BeeGees, only released 10 years ago, and it has background street life and neon signs of Motel Row from a few years before Holmes was there…”Most of these motels are now closed…” etc. A great time capsule!  Anyways, you get to see what it looked like at night in 1978.


    A music video was made for the song in 1978, but not shown to the public until 2004. It features the brothers singing the song in a darkened studio, layered over background video filmed while driving along “Motel Row” on Collins Avenue, a three-mile motel strip in what is now Sunny Isles Beach, Florida. Most of these motels are now closed or demolished, including several whose names are reminiscent of Las Vegas resorts (Castaways, Desert Inn, Sahara, Golden Nugget).

    • bigwick70 6:06 am on January 24, 2015 Permalink | Reply

      I know this is a little off topic but i remember the 80,s, though I was only 11 in 1981. I thought Donna Summer was the sexiest woman alive even at that age lol


    • bigwick70 5:30 am on January 24, 2015 Permalink | Reply

      Does anyone have any info on how Ronnie and Billy Deverell met? I have looked everywhere I can think and can’t find anything. This story is just so fasinating. Ever since seeing the Movie (by accident) i have been hooked. Would really like to see another one made with more info on the players lives instead of just the murders. Thanks


    • localarts 11:49 am on August 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      If Adel Nasrallah took a dirt nap, it would have come across the AP wire at some point.


    • rimbaudgirl 3:43 am on August 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I dont know if it means much but wikipedia says nash died july 4…i know they often get things wrong but arent the dates of birth and death usually right?


    • Mark C 9:57 pm on July 31, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Anybody find out for sure if Eddie Nash died July 4th?? Or is it a internet rumor ??
      I searched could not find out nothing.
      Hey Eddie !!!!! You still on here with your snuggles with built in booties on, kick back on easy chair with TV tray & lap top in front of you??
      I still say that would make my day if we ever track a ISP # back to Ole Nash himself on here enjoying reading about himself.
      One tough guy, He got to be, he about out lived all his old friends. He appears to did enough right heath wise to of made it this long.


      • chris cox 11:24 pm on July 31, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        he is still with us.


      • localarts 5:55 pm on August 2, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        If it’s true, I find it very difficult to believe there is no mention of it in the press. Especially someone as notorious as Nash. I actually remember when Eddie was charged with the Wonderland murders back in 88-89 and it was all over the papers. Maybe Jacob Bartel is a.k.a Eddie Nash? LOL.


    • localarts 4:45 pm on July 16, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      “We hit 500,000 page views this week” Congratulations John. Did you ever think this site would attract such an audience?


    • London 4:57 pm on July 12, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Hi John. you are very close. i grew up a couple of houses up the street from where this happened. I was almost 12 when it occurred. everybody in the house was pretty cool to me. use to give me rides to the country store or pick me up if i was walking.


      • John 9:43 am on July 28, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Thanks London. Please tell some stories if you can? Thanks.


    • localarts 9:00 am on July 10, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      It took me a long to realize how great these guys were. “Nights on Broadway” is a great song as well.


      • Jacob Bartle 9:05 am on July 13, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Eddie Nash died July 4th (two weeks ago) surprised no news here.


        • John 9:49 am on July 28, 2014 Permalink

          Jacob, thanks. Do you have a link to share? I could find nothing.


        • localarts 3:47 pm on July 29, 2014 Permalink

          Wrong! Eddie is the Prince of Darkness…..he will never die.


        • John 12:44 pm on August 4, 2014 Permalink

          It appears so, he’s immortal.


  • John 4:56 pm on July 2, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , wonderland   

    Chuck Negron Performs @ July 4th Festival 07/05/81 

    A few days before this concert, he was at Wonderland.

    This was at Long Beach. Other groups which performed at this event were the Beach Boys and Pablo Cruise.

    This one’s for Joy!!

    • scabiesoftherat 9:22 pm on July 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      This is a really stellar find, John. Great post. I can’t help but wonder what was going through Chuck’s mind while he was performing here. He seems completely at ease up there. He had to have known about it at this point. It was all over the news. If it were me, I would be scanning the wings looking for cops who were waiting to talk to me about my affiliation with such a questionable residence…but not Chuck, man! He’s out there killin’ it in his own right!…and, not to mention, he’s on the same bill with Dennis “i-lived-with-Manson” Wilson of the Beach Boys. The only thing that could make that bill better would be to have Mark Lindsay do a set. Great video. It’s now in my favorites list. (Geez. I never would have known that was a Three Dog Night album next to the couch had it not been for this blog.) That makes this performance even more serendipitous. Just a side observation about this video? You know it’s 1981 when the lead singer of a pop music combo comes out wearing a striped polo shirt that happens to be tucked in,…AND you know it’s 1981 when a girl in the crowd pulls a pack of Marlboro 100s out her cleavage. You can get a ticket for BOTH of those offenses nowadays.


      • John 2:57 pm on July 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I tried to see if he had track marks on his arms, but no luck. He is 6’3 or 4….so in this vid he must weight a buck fifty! Maybe less.


    • Bobby 8:28 am on July 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      No doubt Chuck would’ve sped over to the Wonderland house as soon as he got paid for that gig! ;p
      So, does anybody know if the Three Dog Night record at the crime scene was a gift from Chuck (possibly as an exchange for a discount on dope) or was it already in Joy & Billy’s collection? Such a weird coincidence that it was the ‘one’ (boom-boom!) sleeve that ended up getting splattered in blood! What a morbid collector’s item akin to the album Lennon signed for Mark Chapman. Chuck & Julia must’ve freaked when they learnt about that – really spooky synchronicity considering they nearly went over to the house on that fateful night!


      • Bobby 8:39 am on July 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Er, slight addendum: Guess he wasn’t speeding over to the Wonderland house as I just realised that this concert was a few days after the murders… BUT, had this been before.. LOL – I think y’know what I was getting at… 🙂
        Hmm, wonder who he started scoring off at this stage?…


        • criticextraordinaire 5:54 pm on July 4, 2014 Permalink

          Yeah I kinda wonder that too. The Wonderland Gang’s Wikipedia page describes them as “most influential and feared cocaine distributorship of its time in Los Angeles”. I’ve got to think the next few months saw shortages for customers and turf wars by other dealers trying to carve up the territory.


    • joii 3:34 pm on July 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      what happened to Sol Berlin????


  • John 9:04 am on July 1, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: civil rights, , wonderland   

    Eddie Nash Filed Civil Rights Lawsuit Against L.A. In 2007 

    In the lawsuit, Ed was suing three district attorneys of L.A. for violation of his civil rights. But I couldn’t really find too much on this case, or if it was thrown out, settled, etc.

    Under this law, a citizen can sue the individuals involved who worked for the state, but not the state itself. A company is listed as plaintiff as well, so must be something business-related?

    I will reach out to his civil attorney in the case to ask if I can interview Ed sometime. Through his lawyer, Eddie told Jill who wrote the Holmes book that he would “sleep on it” but then said “No” on the following Monday. I would really like to do a chapter on his early life, more than anything.

    The details:

    Nature of Suit: Civil Rights: Other
    Cause of Action: 42:1983 Civil Rights Act

    Every person who under color of any statute, ordinance, regulation, custom, or usage, of any State or Territory or the District of Columbia, subjects, or causes to be subjected, any citizen of the United States or other person within the jurisdiction thereof to the deprivation of any rights, privileges, or immunities secured by the Constitution and laws, shall be liable to the party injured in an action at law, Suit in equity, or other proper proceeding for redress, except that in any action brought against a judicial officer for an act or omission taken in such officer’s judicial capacity, injunctive relief shall not be granted unless a declaratory decree was violated or declaratory relief was unavailable.  For the purposes of this section, any Act of Congress applicable exclusively to the District of Columbia shall be considered to be a statute of the District of Columbia.

    The number of cases that have been brought under section 1983 has dramatically increased since 1961 when the Supreme Court decided Monroe v. Pape.  In Monroe, the Supreme Court held that a police officer was acting “under color of state law” even though his actions violated state law.  This was the first case in which the Supreme Court allowed liability to attach where a government official acted outside the scope of the authority granted to him by state law.

    Here’s his civil case summary.

    • criticextraordinaire 9:03 am on July 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      An interview with Eddie would be a huge, massive score. I would not expect to get any revelations about the Wonderland hit per se, but he certainly could shine a light on some of the now-deceased players, and perhaps offer some never-before-heard details of the assault on him and Gregory Diles. Your blog takes a very professional approach to the whole story, so maybe Eddie will see your invitation as a way to finally tell his story to somebody who will not sensationalize it or twist it.

      The only version of that story that we hear is the narrative provided by Lind, whose credibility is, uh, *questionable*. We need to hear the other side of the story.

      Would also be great to get Eddie’s take on what it was like to hang out and party with Johnny Wadd, and did he have access to any of John’s costars..


      • Bobby 9:56 am on July 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Couldn’t agree more! It would be great to hear Nash chime in on other aspects of his life unrelated to the murders. I’m guessing he wouldn’t be interested in talking to anyone but who knows, if he was made aware that an objective book was being written about the case he might agree to an interview – sans any deathbed-seque confession of course! Not holding my breath though.


    • Mark C 6:57 pm on July 1, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Nash really did live The American Dream story pretty good himself. It be great to get his true “early life” story and that all. I am not trying to reduce what he did or they say he did to family of Wonderland Victims or anybody else,
      He may be a little bitter about the Wonderland part of his life because he lost a very lot not including the money during that part of his life. Going to jail is no cake walk for anybody. It be something I would not be too eager to talk about myself. But Eddie got where Judge was impressed so much with him that he allowed Eddie out of jail early to get the proper medical treatment he needed to save his life. With out proper medical treatment Eddie could be right now 6 foot under like so many in this case.


      • RAW DOPE BMORE 5:19 pm on July 13, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        ive interviewed nash believe it or not, i got his number on 411.com i paid $2.00 but what the hell i mean this is the “NASH” for heavens sake. but i spoke with his daughter first she was very pleasant and i asked her if she could give him my number and ask her to call and low and behold nomore than 10 minutes later he called under a blocked number and i was very excited, he told me about when they arrested him and that he volunteered in mentoring drug programs all throughout california and that its hard getting old and that hes been clean since his last jail stint and that john holmes was a 2 faced lying rat who was not to be trusted and that he was a coward and he used him to drive his female friends home when he was finish with them and that holmes did so willingly for a single rock of base.and he also said that hes just living in infamy now and thats not him anymore and that if he had to do it over again he wouldnt have ever befriended john holmes and this was about 3 years ago when i called his home oh btw i asked about greg diles and also about life in palestine and he got really edgy and said he might call me back later he was tired and he got his number changed in about a week but luckily i got to meet one of my icons and i thank god for that alot. i guess he probably thought i was paparazzi or the feds but im just a fan of the way he ruled cali with a iron fist and how much money he accumilated without ever blowing his cover as a kingpin he was making more legit money than illegal money my hero


        • Derek 4:23 pm on June 22, 2015 Permalink

          you never spoke with Ed Nash. He hasn’t spoke to his daughter since 1988 and I lived with him till his passing in 2015.


  • John 7:53 am on March 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , wonderland   

    Neighbors Ignore Victims’ Screams 

    Notice Detective Tom Lange just in front of the fire rescue man. The cop back there in casual clothes… well, it must have been his day off. To quote Bob Sousa “Is this gonna ruin my 4th of July weekend?”

    UPI. July 2, 1981.

    UPI. July 2, 1981.

    • dreamweaverjenn 3:45 am on March 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Watching Wonderland as we speak. It’s 4:45 a.m. here and it’s on IFC….


    • localarts 9:03 pm on March 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2N5WTeggnw at 2:27 two men are caring either Joy Miller or Barbara Richardson. I’m just say’in…


    • localarts 2:38 pm on March 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Looks like the UPI has placed the wrong pic with the story. The Wonderland victims were not carried out on gurneys, more like body bags. Two people carried out the women while four individuals carried out the men.


      • John 3:22 pm on March 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I don’t know, but I’ve seen video of a gurney wheeling out the bodies. It was in that XXXL The John Holmes Story video.


      • Colleen 9:28 pm on November 12, 2017 Permalink | Reply

        Looks like a body bag to me. They can put em on stretchers so the body won’t be as heavy and/or to “deal with” crowds yet that wasn’t the case in these murders. But yeah this is Tom Lange in the photo. (Btw Ik im years past ya post…..js) .


  • John 11:41 am on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , wonderland   

    2010: Dawn Schiller Talks To Radio Show 

    Susan Murphy Milano (RIP) was a radio show host, blogger, activist and author for topics like violence towards women, stalking, child abuse. You can check out Dawn’s interview and discussion below. Susan Milano died two years ago, but thankfully she got this interview down in the books. (and no, Susan Milano is not Susan Launius, they just have the same maiden name)

    Susan and Dawn speak for about an hour, and topics are of course:  John Holmes, Dawn’s early childhood, her father, mother, human trafficking.

    Thrown into the waiting arms of adult film star and predator, John Holmes, Dawn Schiller survived years of abuse, substance addiction and human trafficking. Dawn survived the bloody and tragic “Wonderland” murders, and was victimized again when law enforcement claimed her as a wanted fugitive. We will discuss her journey for the entire hour and her work with the phenomena of “Throwaway Teens” and how to identify, recognize and save others before they become a statistic.


    • localarts 10:28 am on February 19, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      My thoughts exactly Jim. Although, I believe it was 1976.


    • Jim 9:49 am on February 19, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      What people need to remember is that when someone (and we all do this) is telling of an incident(s) they were involved in they always try to cast themselves in the best light. In Dawn’s case the “best light” is the role of complete victim. This is not to excuse Holmes. What he did to her in 1975 was terrible and illegal. However people need to realize that Dawn did not remain 15 years old from 1975 to 1981. She was making the same type of choices in 1975 that she was making in 1981. Keep in mind Dawn was 20 or 21 when she chose to return to LA from Oregon to go back to Holmes soon before the Wonderland incident.


    • Brandy 10:50 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      If Dawn needs money, Dawn will find material for another book.


    • jimmy---chicago 8:38 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      My mind was blown the other day . I looked on the sex offender list on line no matter where you live thet are everyware litterally .Type in your address its crazy


    • localarts 8:33 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Big Time! Guys are sent to prison for this kind of thing every day.


    • jimmy---chicago 5:49 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Dosent statutory rape come into play with those two at least in the beginning


      • John 8:02 am on February 18, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I guess in those days it was a slap on the wrist, but if Holmes were alive, they could still go after him maybe? The thing is, I think Dawn chased him just as much as he chased her. I’m reminded of my little sister. She was 16 in the 1980s, in love and chased after this 20 yr old douche-bag until he finally relented and went out with her. A few years later, with kid in tow, they broke up and she wanted the courts and judge to have him arrested for initially molesting her (because of her age). Divorce can be a hateful thing. The court did not see it her way. He’s actually a good man, and has always paid support and visited my niece. He’s just a regular dad.


      • Anon4now 12:23 am on September 20, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Statute of limitations comes into play. And, it appears that many dependants of Vietnam and Vietnam-era veterans just don’t get to live with their parents, end of story and a reason why never to lose a war. As ridiculous as it seems for a seemingly stable couple to abandon their child to a porn star, it may have been simple in a way if Holmes really was a veteran. And that’s an “if.”

        Additionally, the California legal age of consent was lessened from 21 to 18 in 1971, if I remember right. The rationale was that if a person was old enough to get drafted and sent into war, that person should be old enough to behave as an adult. That was a rather broad statement; if I remember right, the legal drinking age was 21 (as it is now) and the same with smoking, both those remained unchanged, but I might be wrong on the latter point. And that was the problem: maybe some people didn’t know if they were legal or not at the time. I remember when the law got passed, and I didn’t think much about it then, but I don’t remember why not. I don’t remember my parents or anyone else’s parents talking about it, and actually very few of my school chums.

        But anyway, statutory rape statute of limitations has long since expired for any contact in that era (’70s and ’80s) that wasn’t between teen girls and Catholics, as we’ve been reading in the papers. Non-violent contact, maybe even with the parent’s knowledge if not their explicit consent, was sort of overlooked then. Not really condoned, I guess, but there goes all the hippie girls to the Grateful Dead concerts and coming home pregnant. Dead head for sure.

        And, if no criminal charges are ever timely filed, and if the statute of limitations has expired, constant mention of a subject like might actually be harassment and slander. Except in Holme’s case there’s photographic evidence, isn’t there?

        Personally, all the best wishes to Schiller. But working at an university in Oregon; is that the best employment for a woman with her experiences? Sex and drug registration laws are strictly enforced in California now, and if Holmes would ever have been prosecuted for his relationship with Schiller, he would have had to register as a sex offender for life. Registration laws here are no joke: Sex offender registration is for life, drug offender isn’t, as the first is Penal Code, the latter Health & Safety and simply expires after a certain time period. Holmes would have had to register as both had he not have been such a snitch when he was busted. But, that’s where the idiocy of the state’s citizenry comes into play, as the citizens who follow registration don’t know the difference in the laws, to them all is unending registration that a felon must endure for the rest of his (or her) life unless they tell.

        And that’s how important this Holmes trial was, how much impact it had on the state’s legislation. It really changed things; so many laws have been altered it’s hard to keep track of it all if you didn’t have a hint somewhere along the line. People watch this movie and read Schiller’s stories, and they say “Not again!” And that’s the end of casual contact with California women, sung about so much by the Beach Boys. Drug offender registration isn’t just for opiates (like Lind and Barbara are shown doing so much of. They’d be registered offenders, too), it’s for supplying pot to minors. Simple pot smokers don’t always escape the registration game even with the new legalization movement. This movie hits home on California legislation and court procedure in a vital time period: Shortly after the end of Vietnam, and less than a decade from the lessening of the state’s legal age of consent. Total confusion, and with all the money behind Holmes’ profession, and all the impact that Lind brought with him, the state got put into even more of a spin with this Wonderland trial. But that’s all part of the game, too.

        Why doesn’t Schiller work at a California university? And please post this, John. There’s nothing inflammatory in it and it touches on some important California issues that led to the confusion of the ’70s and later decades.


    • John 5:19 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Thanks Jill. I was going to comment on conflicting statements about Dawn’s time in Florida, post Wonderland… But I didn’t have my references handy. As discissed before on this blog, the selling of Dawn on the beach to Tricks and Big Marge “saving her” and the LA gumshoes tracking her tothe strip club. Too many versions of events floating around from Dawn.


      • criticextraordinaire 6:36 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I think that was Big Rosie and some dude named Joe from the snack shop at the Fountainhead. Now there would be a real score, if somebody could track them down to get their version of the happenings in Miami back then.

        I wonder if Dawn has enough material for another book?


        • John 5:37 pm on February 18, 2014 Permalink

          Yes, Joe and also the Cuban guy who was a male stripper who also stayed at Fountainhead. When John could not find steady work the stripper guy allegedly let Dawn clean his room a few times… Luckily cig’s and beer were cheap back then. Crazy times!!


      • Jill C. Nelson 10:46 am on February 18, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        “As discissed before on this blog, the selling of Dawn on the beach to Tricks and Big Marge “saving her” and the LA gumshoes tracking her tothe strip club. Too many versions of events floating around from Dawn.”

        Yes, and the story about “Louise the stripper.” I don’t doubt that a stripper named Louise factored into the events in Florida, but again the version in TRTW is not exactly how detectives Lange and Tomlinson described it to us.
        It’s always best to stick to one truthful account of a story, especially when there are people still alive who can attest otherwise.


    • Jill C. Nelson 4:31 pm on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      “He was quite a romantic. He set it up at the beach, that it just so happened that my sister wasn’t there and he asked me to go camping by myself. It was like we both knew that it was the night.
      We went to Malibu, Zuma Beach and went to Leo Carrillo, a campsite there. It was a full moon, low in the sky. It was perfect and he was very quiet. I can remember just watching him as I walked along the beach, sat on the rocks and watched the moon. It was very magical. Without saying anything, he got down from that rock, took my hand and walked to the van. That was the night. He was extremely gentle and just awesome. I felt as if I was his newborn child or something — that’s how precious he treated me.” — Dawn Schiller, John Holmes: A Life Measured in Inches © 2008, Jennifer Sugar and Jill C. Nelson (original dialogue and script text from WADD: The Life & Times of John C. Holmes, provided by Hustler Video.)

      No matter how anyone might feel about the action itself, I post this excerpt above simply as an illustration of the contrasting depictions (by Schiller) of this night shared between Schiller and Holmes in the interview she did for WADD, compared to TRTW. It seems that every time the story is described, it changes somewhat. The event itself and the emotions expressed between the WADD interview and TRTW are quite different. I remember when I read about this experience in Dawn’s book, how surprised I was by the way in which the episode and her reaction to it had been adjusted. It’s one of many events that have been tweaked. This is why Dawn did not want Sugar and I to use her WADD transcripts for our bio.


      • John 11:31 am on March 30, 2018 Permalink | Reply

        It’s interesting that Leo Carrillo beach came into play. Nash’s only showbiz credit was in Cisco Kid, in which the stereotyped sidekick, Pancho, who would be an outrage today, was portrayed by one Leo Carrillo! One of the only legit Hispanics on the show. I say “outrage” because Pancho is no less insultjng than the “Frito Bandito” guy in those old commercials.

        How are you Jill? What new book are you working on?



    • Brandy 11:42 am on February 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I think I’ve heard enough of Dawn Schiller for a lifetime.


  • John 2:07 pm on January 10, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , , wonderland   

    Porn Star’s Death Doesn’t Make For Humor 

    When John Holmes died in 1988, a local writer for the Texan, the school newspaper for the University of Texas, wrote a scathing rebuttal to an earlier hit piece in The Austin Chronicle (which is a free city paper found at any bus stop). The original column which I cannot find now, was titled something like “I’m glad he’s dead”. It was very brief, rude and is best summarized below by Lee Nichols. It’s strange, because as heated as both articles were, neither mentioned the Wonderland saga. Quite a bizarre war of words, and it happened 25+ years ago. In 1988, people still did not understand AIDS. Hell, I still remember the bad jokes. Famine, cancer and AIDS are just not good topics for comedy.

    Have a nice weekend.



    • John 7:43 pm on July 29, 2020 Permalink | Reply

    • localarts 10:38 am on January 16, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      That interview with Niles is the crown jewel of this forum, it’s the freak’in bomb!


    • Phil - Australia 10:41 pm on January 15, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Great site! Can’t get enough of it with so much detail on offer….what’s Eddie Nash up to these days? Have you seen him lately John or read anything about him and his whereabouts?…the proposed book ‘four on the floor’ by the two detectives is nowhere to be found…any word if it will ever be published….thanks heaps John.


    • Jill C. Nelson 8:05 am on January 14, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      They met up, just never in film.


      • jimmy---chicago 11:47 am on January 15, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Really I could not find anything that had them being in the same spot ever


    • localarts 6:03 pm on January 13, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Very true Jimmy. Last summer a group of people I was with we’re talking about Behind the Candelabra; this eventually led us to talking about Wonderland. Out of the 12 or 13 people that were there (friends of friends) I think only 4 people knew who John Holmes was including me. People forget an entire generation has passed and technology has come a long, long way.


      • criticextraordinaire 7:32 pm on January 13, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        We need to educate the younger generation about John Holmes and his contemporaries. Hopefully his body of work has been preserved in digital format and archived in one of those underground vaults.


        • jimmy---chicago 7:30 am on January 14, 2014 Permalink

          I am suprised holmes and linda lovelace never met up in film


    • jimmy---chicago 2:34 pm on January 13, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I was born in 1970 most people who were born after that probably would not know who Holmes was and wonderland forget it try to bring up holmes to thirty somethings porn has exploded since then with movies going straight to dvd by the thousands movies being made in basements and motels everyware


    • criticextraordinaire 1:41 pm on January 11, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Here’s a link to the original article http://www.michaelcorcoran.net/archives/2283

      “He who lives by the sword…”
      Posted: April 12, 2013 | Author: mcorcoran | Filed under: Uncategorized | Leave a comment »
      By Michael Corcoran

      Justice has prevailed. John “Johnny Wadd” Holmes has AIDS! Finally, the guy whose member looked like the whole goddamn club has paid his debt to a society of guys whose sexual satisfaction came mainly from tossing off in sweaty stag closets while Big John eyed Miss Utah runners-up and went about filling them softly with his schlong, which looked like it took four “D” cell batteries. How I hated the guy with the Marty Allen haircut and the state of Florida between his legs. There he was, flickering in the dark, beckoning a procession of love slaves to “lay some skull on me, bitch,” and there I’d be, pitifully fueling his libido with quarters I’d stolen from my uncle’s coin collection, until 40 pieces of silver later I’d200px-John_Holmes2 make like a clumsy parrot and spill my seed. I’d watch Johnny play the meat in a variety of sandwiches, shining his flashlight into countless caverns and then walk away from the money shot like he’d just played a few hands of gin rummy. Then I’d go home and repeatedly dial the first six digits of the phone number of the girl who stuck the ends of her hair up her nostrils in social studies. I swore than if I ever had, like one month to live, the first thing I’d do is hunt down and kill Johnny Wadd and then I’d tell the girl from social studies to lay some skull on me. If I had only a day or two to live, I’d tell her to lay some skull on me, bitch.

      Those years of sexual frustration are long gone for me; I’ve had skull laid on me in eight states and Nuevo Laredo, and still the news about Johnny Wadd read like the headlines on V-J Day. I was fairly ecstatic when he was sent to prison for a few years for refusing to identify the killers of some coke dealers, but knowing that he was bisexual and had made a few gay films it became sort of a good news/ bad news deal. But now… I’m walking on air.”

      You can bet there was no joy in Smutville when it was announced that the Great White Hope, the Larry Bird of penis size, the guy who made the man with the Golden Arm feel shortchanged, is now packing a deadly weapon in his BVDs. Heck, Seka probably can’t give it away these days. Since J.W. worked both sides of the street and did a deuce in the joint with guys who get hot when they see pictures of the Grand Canyon, the odds that he got the deadly dose from heterosexual intercourse are about what you’d expect a horse with Jimmy Breslin in the saddle to go off at. Still, he probably nailed a few hundred bleachpits since contracting AIDS, and I can’t recall Johnny Wadd ever rolling out the latex carpet while the farmers’ daughters stripped down to their neck scarves. There probably hasn’t been this much panic in the jizz biz since ’86 when a studio guard yelled out, “Here comes Traci Lords’ father and does he look mad!” Serves ‘em right, the lucky stiffs.

      If there is a God, and I’m beginning to feel like there is, he won’t send Johnny Wadd to either heaven or hell, but banish him to an eternity in a porno booth watching a loop of lonely guys with small thingies having sex with wayward starlets, while Roy Cohn looks through the glory hole and whispers “Need any help in there?”


    • Mark C 3:20 am on January 11, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I remember back in 83 or 84 I was running Heavy Equipment & listen to radio all day long to pass the time.and I remember like it was yesterday that they said on FM radio station that soon you will be able to hear John Holmes right here on radio singing because he is right now in a studio making I think a whole music album.. I though to myself wow that going be strange to say the least. I think that one porn star woman done had made that Disco hit out few years before that. She did something the same during that whole song. So I guess I thought this could very well be possible & not a joke.
      But as we know now appears that is one dream did not come completely true for him.
      So I guess that scene in Boogie Nights do have some truth in it.
      Any of you remember hearing about this too??
      Not many people I know heard about that in my area, And myself mainly because dumb luck and having to spend 10 to 12 hours daily I was stuck in a little place with seat in something smaller than a phone booth.


    • John W 5:37 pm on January 10, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Yes, I was in the hallway at high school when I overheard the news. I had not seen any porn, shocking!, but I still knew who the King was.


    • criticextraordinaire 4:51 pm on January 10, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      The day that John died was indeed a sad one. I remember hearing the horrendous news as I drive into work that morning. When I arrived at the office I mentioned “Sad Day, John C. Holmes just passed away. “.

      A girl who worked for me was instantly dejected. “Johnny Wadd died? Man, I saw every one of his movies. This sucks.”

      ‘Twas the end of an era. The King was dead. Long Live the King. 😦


  • John 1:36 pm on December 20, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , john holmes documentary, wonderland   

    Another British Documentary With Rare Footage 

    This is a different documentary that I have never seen before. It is not to be confused with the other British documentary that most of us have seen on YouTube. It is good resolution and very clear… and has great unseen footage and interviews. I was going to wait until Monday, but I have other stuff to post next week. The Wonderland stuff starts at about the 30 minute mark. Please post in the comments if you know anything about it.

    In this documentary, you get to see:

    • Video snippets of Eddie Nash walking around and being hounded by the press. That smirk is undeniable!
    • Alternate views of Eddie’s house- very good angles and views
    • Video of John being led out of court or jail in a parking lot in handcuffs
    • Prosecutor Ron Coen showing where Holmes bloody palm print was on the bed
    • More interviews with Det. Tom Blake
    • Interviews with who I think is Nash cohort and Holmes’ friend, Hal Glickman (who was a bail bondsman)
    • Pre-trial and trial footage from court
    • Talk of Holmes’ hunger strike while in jail on contempt charges. “He went on a hunger strike…and gained weight. He fasted between meals” –Ron Coen
    • Laurie Holmes talks about John’s mortal remains and how they were spread off the coast of Oxnard or Santa Catalina with his immediate family present
    • Warning! Nudity
    • Jude Falu 1:58 am on October 25, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Wow! Thank you! I permanently wanted to write on my site something like that. Can I include a fragment of your post to my site?


    • localarts 1:29 pm on December 31, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I can only imagine what the New Years Eve parties were like at Wonderland! It would probably take at least a week to recover.


    • russell White 12:19 am on December 29, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Great new info John. Not sure how you are doing it, but I am blown away! I have been online for 10 years and never heard one bit about the dogs. Also, did you find out if Susan is still alive. When I talked to Nils last year, he did not know but doubted, based on her health.


    • localarts 6:25 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Unfortunately, there’s not a lot of information about Lind. He may very well have been in the WPP. I know he went into hiding immediately after spilling his guts to Lange and Souza, Lind was picked up a month later by the LAPD.

      I can definitely see the Butch Cassidy & the Sundance Kid angle, especially at the end. I would much rather see Ronnie go out in a hail of gun fire with the LAPD like Newman & Redford did at the end of the movie as opposed to having his brains beaten out of his skull while he was asleep. As Ronne & David burst out of the front door of Nash’s with Deverell not far behind, jefe de la policía (Daryl Gates) and the rest of the LAPD open fire and the rest is history!


    • localarts 1:01 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I can see this. Of course you would have to include the Lind & Deverell.


      • criticextraordinaire 4:48 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Oh absolutely. That was likely a big part of the dynamic. Ronnie and David each doing the Nash hit trying to prove just how bad ass each were. And Billy pretty much had to go along on the job after all that big talk he and Tracy said about “going it alone” on the job.

        David might be a good subject for a flick too, what with his various brushes with famous people and situations. There’s still a small part of me that thinks he went into the WPP though.


        • John 10:50 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          In the movie about Ronnie flick, you could have his character played by Ryan Gosling, that way women and teenage girls would go see it. Ron could break the fourth wall by winking at the camera at the end of key scenes, like a classic or bad Burt Reynolds comedy.


        • criticextraordinaire 11:18 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          Well that approach could work, John… if the movie is done like “Goodfellas” and is told from Ronnie’s perspective. Occasionally the scene can stop and Ronnie offers his insight. “We got it all… the dope, the money, the guns. We had Johnny Wadd literally hanging out at our place. Even the vaunted Eddie Nash was on his knees to us. We ruled the world…”

          I’d like to see Suge Knight play the role of Greg Diles. Cast Owen Wilson in the role of Holmes. I’ve got to think about the rest of the cast. For Ronnie I always wanted to go with Joe Elmore, the guy on Horsepower TV.


        • switzerland avenue 3:21 am on December 31, 2013 Permalink

          I would love to see a wonderland movie done in the way of “gone baby gone”. No famous actors, but capable of expressing the real side of drug consuming and trafficking. For the bigger budget version: Daniel Day-Lewis as Nash and send Paul Giamatti to that damn mask and let him do holmes’ last years…


    • Mark C 6:01 pm on December 25, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      In a strange way I think through so many years of all the very well published & known lies & bull stories told by John Holmes himself through out his whole life, This only adds greatly to more of the mystery of this story.

      Not only we got 1 huge unpunished unsolved multi person cold blooded murder case appears everybody even over seas are very interested in . Eddie was charged with Conspiracy to commit murder and not Capital Murder. I guess I might be wrong, But I feel its is still a open murder case on LA police record books, Thanks’ to John consent lying we have to work our way through all the huge collection of what really John told people and separate what was the real truth fact’s and what was a other one of his countless lies he was well known to tell.. Even without the multi-murder case on John’s record. I think John Holmes true life story could very well went down in history as he was one of the biggest and best liars this world ever known. Plus it would sell I think hugely at the box office.

      I am all for a movie about the real true life story of Ronnie Launius that hopefully will end in a shadow of a arm and pipe coming toward Ronnie head while he sound asleep..

      But come down to it. John Holmes true life story has never ever been put on film properly either . That Boogie Nights movie was just a movie that used only a small part of John life as a movie making idea and rest was made up. Wonderland a great movie in its own right but it only covered about a 1 year period in all these peoples life’s and not a long term life story of any of these people involved.
      This case could have at least 2 separate very good movies story’s here.. I think they should not be combine these peoples life story into 1 movie. Both Ronnie and John both deserve a movie based on each of there own true life story ..
      Even today I feel sure all the interest just in The John Holmes name you have a huge group of people waiting for his true life story movie to hit the big screen. We just have to face it John Holmes name collect interest in huge amount of the people not only in the USA, But world wide even today after 26 years after his death. It be very hard to even find a famous Hollywood Star that would draw all that much world wide attention after all these years.

      Well Eddie Nash has really got a very interesting true life story too.
      I feel sure they at least 2 maybe more very great true movie plots in these people who life’s came together very violently on a very hot summers night in 1981 in city of Angles .

      This give anybody any great ideas, Don’t forget about me now!! I sure could help out in some manner and sure could use just a few extra dollars throw my way if our dream would come true on these movies idea. Nope don’t know 1st thing about movie business but I am a fast learner.

      But this is just about a almost once in life time chance of finding 2 & maybe 3 people who true life stories would make such wonderful & great true life movies that are begging to be made.


      • criticextraordinaire 12:13 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Mark, I too would like to see a movie about Ronnie, but I’d prefer that it end just as he and the guys are leaving Eddie’s place, basking in their moment of (short-lived) triumph. Kind of a Butch-and-Sundance feel to it.

        I can actually see the final shot. It is a freeze frame where you see Ronnie busting out the door at Dona Lola, looking like the cat that ate the canary; he’s slightly out of focus. Meanwhile, Eddie is in the background, sharp focus, with a look on his face that unmistakably portends the rest of the story. Roll the credits and the epilogue text.


        • mark c 8:24 pm on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          criticextraordinaire I think you completely correct that would be a so much better ending for a Ronnie movie. Anybody served in Vietnam I always have the upmost very high regard for them. Lot of them guys when through a non-sleep 1 whole year nightmare that stays with them even today. I personally seen couple times what happens during them guys having flashbacks, Not a pretty site to see at all without going into much detail.

          In Army supply Ronnie just might had to fill some tanks or bombs with agent orange or was standing right there supervising it to keep track of the gallons used.. You never really know the true process unless you was there.
          Armed services are famous for what is it they call it ? something like SASFU or something like that. not a too pretty name that explains there daily grind.
          But I feel the wonderland gang know who they was going to hit before hand. They just didn’t care or thought they could pull it off without major paybacks, I think I read they was moving elsewhere right after the heist anyway. I blame Holmes and his big line of BS for that mistake. Holmes wanted all the money & drugs but he sure made sure he would not be right there involved in the heist itself. He sat home with the girls . Mr. Lind just don’t want to get more any more dirty than he already was..
          I feel sure Holmes made a key to that security gate for Wonderland House too.. More than likely within the first 5 minutes he first had a key to the gate, before they took it back away from him, I guess for smoking all that dope he smoked and he didn’t pay for. Plus all of Ronnie’s “Scum Bag Tax” . added up too.
          I like that part about one of Holmes porn pal’s talking about Holmes telling people all the degrees he got from UCLA. The Closest Holmes ever got to UCLA was stealing stereos out of cars in the parking lot.
          Nothing on TV tonight, I am going to watch Wonderland again!!


        • criticextraordinaire 8:25 am on December 29, 2013 Permalink

          Well Mark, Johnny could not have gone on the actual Nash invasion. Eddie and Greg knew John so he would have been dead meat had he been there. (Although it ended up that way anyway, due to John wearing the jewelry the next day) The only way John could have participated in the actual invasion would be if they had agreed to kill Eddie.

          Eddie didn’t know Ronnie, David, or Billy, which was odd given their alpha-dog status in the dope business at the time. John did go to Eddie’s THREE TIMES to make sure the sliding door was left unlocked for the guys though, so he certainly was an active participant in the heist, albeit in a clandestine role.

          I can’t help but think that if they were doing the heist today, Tracy would have been driving a stolen SUV instead of that clapped-out Granada, and there would have been plenty of room for John to have waited with him in the car.

          Whenever John smoked up that shipment he was supposed to deliver for the gang, I’ll bet Ronnie was absolutely furious. Due to Ronnie’s extensive experience in the Air Force logistics command, he knew this was going to throw off the production and inventory numbers, and he already had enough headaches managing his supply chain. Big mistake for Johnny.


    • criticextraordinaire 8:01 pm on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      First time I’ve seen this documentary. The things that struck me were:

      1. Amerson trying to swing that bat in the cage was a riot.

      2. Coen still can’t accept that he lost the case and that Holmes was found innocent.

      3. David Bowman comes off as a complete butt munch.

      4. “Here lady, let me show you my identification”

      5. There was the one scene where the porn distributor talked about Holmes saying that having sex with some random porn star “was real”. Lori then got a very odd look on her face, almost a look of betrayal like maybe John had told her that “it was real”. That was a sad scene.


    • Jill C. Nelson 5:11 pm on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      This is “XXXL: The John Holmes Story” released in the U.K in 2000. Lots of footage from “Exhausted” here. The documentary was/is not legally designated for release in the United States or Canada.

      “Holmes bloody palm print was on the bed.”
      Again, it’s important to note that the palm print was not bloody.


      • Ken D. 6:06 pm on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Yes Jill,you are correct….. Had the palm print been bloody Holmes most likely would not have beat the charges. During his trial his lawyers contended that with as much time as Holmes had spent in the house prior to the murders,it would not be unsusual at all for the palm print to be there and other places in the house. Had it been bloody,they would not have been able to argue this….


      • scabiesoftherat 1:05 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Two things struck me as being odd about this. Amerson says John went to his house covered in blood and Sharon says the same thing. I mean, which is it? Also, the palm print for the prosecution is/can be a carrot before the cart type deal when it comes to a jury. John was in that house so much, yet they decline to tell how many OTHER places his fingerprints/handprints were because to do so would knock the wind out of their sails, so to speak. That would be rather anti-climactic to a jury. Just a thought. (That, of course, is not to say that I think John was innocent. I just think holmes got damn lucky that the print WASN’T bloody….considering the amount of blood Amerson and Sharon said he had on him…if one or the other actually saw him that morning. They probably all went out to breakfast.)

        Just a thought.

        PS. That pinky ring on Tom Blake. LOL. What was the cameraman’s thought process about that one? LOL

        (“….must get shot of that ring before we leave,….the boys in editing won’t believe this….”)

        Sorry. I digress. That was the strangest camera shot of the whole documentary,….you know, except for when holmes stood up pulled his junk out in front of that woman. It was then that I thought, “Oh, shit,…this IS German TV.”

        Awesome documentary though. Wish I knew who the guy with the parrot on his head was. (Good Lord. Never, ever thought I would write a sentence like that.)


        • Ken D. 1:58 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Bill Amerson is a well known bullshit artist so I would tend to think that it was him who was lying about a bloody John Holmes coming to his house that morning.


        • Jill C. Nelson 7:14 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          “Awesome documentary though. Wish I knew who the guy with the parrot on his head was.”

          That was Joel Sussman, a first rate photographer and one of Holmes’ closest friends.


        • criticextraordinaire 1:54 pm on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          I’d love to see Amerson do an interview for this blog. Heck, it would have to be a SERIES of interviews since he has so much material for sure. Joel Sussman would be another great interview and I’ll bet he would be willing. Something tells me that Amerson would want to be paid.


        • scabiesoftherat 11:44 pm on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Thank you Ken and Jill for the answers to my questions. Much appreciated.
          PS. Good find, John. As usual.

          Holmes brother was pretty insightful in this doc.


    • Bobby 10:19 pm on December 20, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Just got through watching it – nice doco with lots of archival footage I’d never seen before. It was also great seeing Ron Coen showing the exact location of the hand print on Launius’s bed frame. No mention of David Lind though as they really wizzed through the Wonderland chapter. Regardless, a great find John!


  • John 3:24 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , wonderland   

    David Lind’s Cousin Fills In Some Gaps 

    I reached out to his cousin, whom I found online. This is what she sent me. I won’t post the photo of Dave’s mom, but she is a nice looking woman. Dave was married, but I have only found public record of a divorce, which was in the late 60s or early 70s.

    Read on… (Thanks Dev!)

    My family has tried to stay away from the whole incident. I know that David’s mother, who was my grandfather’s sister, was very embarrassed by the whole thing. I, of course, am more removed, so when my mother told me about it, I was quite fascinated, and was living in LA, so of course I went to visit the house.

    I also met Dawn a few years ago, and told her I was related to David. She was very sweet.  She signed her book for me, which I still need to get around to reading…..did you read it?

    My mom has told me that he was not very involved with the family, but when he was around he was a really fun person, very much a ladies’ man, and there was always a feeling of danger when he was around.  He always had his motorcycle with him.  I don’t know if he was actually a part of a Hell’s Angels chapter or not, but I am sure he knew them.  He did have a wife and two children, I believe.  I think he was divorced, I never met any of them, I think they live in Northern California.

    I am attaching a picture of his mother, she is the most beautiful woman.  David had a younger brother who also has distanced himself from our family, he is in the Pacific Northwest, I think, with his family.  David’s real father left when he was fairly young, and his mother found another man who was a soldier in WW2, and was very stable and loving. So any darkness that David inherited I would say came from his father, whoever he was.  I think we only have one photo of him.

    • localarts 10:41 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I’m sure Mort knew better than to blow cigarette smoke in Dave’s face as he had so many of his other guest. Would really to see this episode.


    • localarts 9:21 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      A DVD version of Dave’s appearance on that show would make a great Christmas gift!!


      • John 9:41 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        From what has been said about that episode… Dave was about to permanently relocate that cigarette into Mort’s right nostril.


    • criticextraordinaire 5:48 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      John scores another exclusive. Oddly the part I find most fascinating is that this gal got Dawn to sign her book but has not gotten around to reading it.

      Would be nice to hear what David’s kids would have to say about his years both before and after 1981, as we don’t seem to know much about him. Maybe they would have David’s appearance with Morton Downey Jr. on a VCR tape.


    • dreamweaverjenn 11:01 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I am fascinated by this. Have always wanted to know more about David Lind. Thank you so much for sharing.


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